Amanda Folson and Ben Edmunds are joined by Mike Wales and Michael Lopp to discuss the hardest problem in software - people. Also make sure to check out the books recommended during this episode: Crucial Conversations: Tools for Talking When Stakes Are High Nine Minutes on Monday: The Quick and Easy Way to Go From Manager to Leader Radical Candor: Be a Kick-Ass Boss Without Losing Your Humanity Managing Humans: Biting and Humorous Tales of a Software Engineering Manager